Post-living free labour! Strap trays on their heads or something. Need your grain milled in dry season while the wind’s down? Attach zombies to your quernstone! You’re just not thinking creatively about all the advantages of the, ah, minor zombie apocalypse there…
There is a Japanese novel (with manga and movie adaptions) called “The Empire Of Corpses” that, though it went off the rails a bit at the end, has a really really interesting and extensive take on this played 100% straight. Might be worth a glance. Basically it’s the Victorian age British Empire (alongside other great powers) where Dr Victor Frankenstein was a real person who developed reanimation technology, and the basic knowledge gets out to the general world. Unlike him they can’t fully replicate/replace the “soul” but they can make a limited artificial program/soul for it called Necroware. They then simply use it like any other scientific invention, with corpses raised and programmed (necroware programming and engineering is now a profession) to perform all sorts of basic roles in terms of labor, combat, etc.
The novel itself has plenty of flaws towards how the plot goes down in the end, but even so I haven’t seen anything quite like it. It’s kind of a wild visualization, like a necromantic steam/clockwork version of mass automation.
It’s probably because in most settings the undead basically radiate dark magic/energy/etc so on an industrial scale it’s actually less healthy than using unshielded plutonium for everything.
There’s a reason that necromancers look creepy.
I don’t think that’s a good idea. He is fond of Rinku, yes, but can you imagine the MESS that would arise if he’d learn that she is Link? Not to mention that if his underlings learn they might try to kill her. There is Millennia of Link-centred trauma inside Ganon’s mind. We don’t know what he might do if he learns the truth.
He just needs one huge reminder that in this particular timeline NO ONE wants little Rinku to turn into Link. And that if Ganon can stay a good Ganondad, he would actually be taking steps to ensure that it doesn’t happen. The problem is the conversation would need to take place below about 50 tons of rock so by the time Ganon would have dug himself out he could have calmed down enough to think rationally.
Zombie Apocalypse can be a tourist attraction!
I’m kinda reminded of that episode of B99 where they were voting for the new president of Black&Gay police officer organization and Holt was all “This kid has NO IDEA what we had to go through to get here”.
“Maybe that’s just a matter of opinion”, “History is a matter of speculation”…
Postmodern virus infection, late stages? Godammit, G! Not you! Not you!!
(sobs)
We’ll miss you, man.
A postmodernist lense will give you the idea that nothing is objectively good or bad. When used to view history, most things turn amorally grey and no concrete good or ill can be seen.
That being said, Ganondorf is not going postmodern on his own history, but rather pointing out that history is written by those who win, and that he very much has good reasonings behind his choices. I think Wind Waker’s Ganondorf does this better, but there he was justifying it to Link and not his great-times-infinity granddaughter.
History is NOT written by those who win: Somehow, we all hate the Mongols despite them doing nothing but win; the Athenians lost the Peloponnesian war, but they wrote the history of it; we’ve got a lot of records from Egypt indicating they won a battle and their opponents claiming a victory in the same engagement; the Prussians were far more significant to Waterloo than Wellington; the Lost Cause myth has been incredibly pervasive in the US, despite the Confederate’s loss; the list can go on and on.
The literate write; what we have may or may not be the victors perspective.
History is written by those who win, and then endure. Those that endure, after all, are the true winners of the war, no matter the battles in between.
The Mongols won and won and won but tanked their empire really hard, really fast – in the end, they weren’t the winners. The Athenians lost the Peloponnesian War but later subsumed Sparta as Greece became a thing.
Put another way, victory does not mean success, and what the saying really should be is that history is written by the successful.
..the Confederacy seems a bit of an outlier, though I’d argue that the main thread of the Civil War that’s taught is still that it was fought to free the slaves, immediately painting it into a black and white good guy vs. bad guy scenario, with the Confederacy as the bad guy. Get deeper and it’s more complicated, of course.
And important thing to remember is that while the Union, under Lincoln, fought to simply reunite the Union, the Confederates separated and fought against Northern aggression so as to keep their highly profitable economy from being taken away from them. It was as much a battle of slavery and a battle of state’s rights.
The South wanted to retain the right, as states, to determine big ticket things like slavery, the North largely just wanted to reign in the unruly and petulant children that were throwing a collective tantrum because the North had decided that human lives are a priceless thing and people can not be bought or sold and thusly would destroy the economy of the South in the name of equality.
You’re right that the Civil War is painted in a black and white manner but is in fact a lot more nuanced, but the reason “The South shall rise again” is still a thing is because of a very primal Us vs Them mentality bred among the more fanatical Southern locals. To them the North were the aggressors, and they’re kinda right. To them the war was unjust and wrong, even if their side were fighting for a thing most of them would agree is a terrible thing.
Also, I agree that “History is written by those who endure” is probably a better way of putting what I said previously. In the context of MGDMT and other LoZ(-ish) comics wherein Ganondorf remembers all of his lives Ganondorf is the ultimate history book, able to bring forward information for which the historians of any era he finds himself would kill. In this case, Urbosa being a giant brat about the events of Ocarina of Time, he is the one who endured, but so, too, did Hyrule and Zelda. Hyrule did what it, as the one who seemingly properly endured, would do, and wrote about his atrocities as if he was a monster hellbent on destruction. Meanwhile in Wind Waker we get Ganondorf’s side of the events of OoT, wherein he started off with the best of intentions, helping his people as their king, but things spiraled out of control, forcing him to change with the tides of history into the very beast Hyrule would claim he was the entire time.
To be fair, we never really got to see what life was like for the Gerudo before Ganondorf was around. From what WW tells us, it was kinda terrible, but that account was from Ganondorf himself, so make of it what you will. I personally subscribe to the theory that he was a decent king until he went mad with power.
Incidentally, Urbosa is my favorite of the old Champions.
I’d believe it. WW Ganondorf is really beaten down and mellowed out by the weight of his own failures and doesn’t strike me as really giving a damn about lying to make himself sound better. He doesn’t even intend to kill Link or Tetra until after he goes mad with rage when he loses the Triforce.
That’s why we love the Mongols, think that the US Civil War was about anything other than slavery, think France was totally asking for the Franco-Prussian War, think Athens won the Peloponnesian War, have extensive writings from Germanic tribes about Teutoberg…
Well actually…
The mongols under Genghis Khan DID bring a lot of good things with them, including but not limited to laws, literature, nationalism(back when that was a good thing), and wealth.
But the other stuff, yeah, more or less.
Yeah Mongols were a perfect case study in a lot of good things being done alongside what is to our modern minds a lot of bad stuff, with the mongols you can’t ignore one side of the coin in favor of the other since their both so intertwined. Nor should you justify the horrible things done, BUT that said it’s good to consider all those horrible things in the context of the times they happened in.
The US civli war was about the south wanting to secede and become it’s own country which the north was not cool with. The whole freeing slaves thing was more ir less something the north did just to piss off the south.
Yes, but the South didn’t declare succession until AFTER the Emancipation Proclamation, and the Charters of Succession for almost every confederate state included slavery among the “rights” they wanted to protect from Federalist control.
I don’t disagree that the proximate cause of the Civil War was slavery. Perhaps one could argue that the underlying resentment stemming from loss of regional power (that is, the election of Abraham Lincoln without a single Southern electors’ support) may have been the cause, but it doesn’t really hold water. The Lincoln-Douglas debates from the senate race of 1858 clearly demonstrate this, though they do show the nuance of the pro-slavery argument (which are far more nuanced than many arguments today relating to questions of human dignity for “inconvenient” persons).
However, I’m not finding anything online called “Charters of Succession.” I think you mean “declarations of secession.” The Emancipation Proclamation came after the Union victory at Antietam in September 1862 (after over a year of fighting). It fails the sniff test as an argument, because we know the war has been going on for over a year, and declarations of secession were issued in early 1861 (if you meant “secession,” then you’re just wrong about this), and any laws passed relating to “succession” wouldn’t really be significant, inasmuch as they related to causes, particularly since causes were well-documented in 1861. Could you elaborate on the “charters?”
Yes, secession. Apologies, I am unsure if I simply misspelled that or if it was “corrected” but I did not mean succession. What I mean is, every state that joined the Confederacy had a document outlying their intent to leave the Union and almost every single included their “right” to slavery as a reason. When I say charters, I mean with a lowercase C, because that wasn’t what they were officially called. Regardless, this was all before the war broke out because none of the states attempted to secede AFTER it was over.
TLDR: the confederates at the time emphasized: “We’re doing this because a black man would be worth about $50,000 in 2018 after adjusting for inflation, so a hundred slaves is $5,000,000 worth of property creating millions of dollars worth of profit every year. And those damned Yankees have the gall to suggest that basic human rights are more important than our continued luxurious lifestyles – especially after we’ve spent so much effort rationalizing and spreading racist beliefs to justify talking about our freedoms while treating other people like cattle. Also, because we have money we’re going to make our poor white neighbors go out and fight on our behalf while we talk about needing to stay at home and prevent slave uprisings, because we haven’t done enough yet to emphasize what hypocrites we are.”
It takes some higher brand of mind-screwing hypocrisy to be a devout Christian while wholeheartedly supporting slavery… Then again that accusation can be aimed at most of the white world at the time…
Slavery in general IS biblical, though. The particular variety of slavery that led to the American Civil War probably wasn’t the sort of slavery they were talking about in the Bible, though. (Not saying slavery is a good thing, but I do think it’s important to remember that historically, it wasn’t considered a truly heinous evil until recently, relatively speaking.)
Biblical… how? That slavery has existed? The behavior of what a Christian should be, if they were a slave? “Love your neighbor as yourself,” “Bear one another’s burdens,” and “Go and make disciples of the nations” doesn’t particularly sounds slavery-approved to me.
Even in the Old Testament when the Hebrews were heading into the Promised Land, God commanded them to slaughter everything and everyone they came across (likely to prevent religious contamination and idol worship. When the Hebrews didn’t… well, there was a LOT of examples of them falling away from the faith.) Back to my point, though, the Hebrew people were never commanded to take or make slaves. Others may have offered to become their servants under false pretenses – which the Hebrews then honored rather than killing them, so that God would not punish them for breaking their oaths (Joshua 9).
Both Old and New Testament have many examples for the lack of “slavery is good” arguments. This didn’t stop people of the Civil War era from trying to use it to justify their own thoughts, however – iirc, they frequently referenced the “curse of Noah” where he proclaimed the offspring of Ham would be the servants of his other children: a curse spoken by a -man- and not by God.
No; the South seceded to maintain and expand slavery. During the course of the war, it became clear to the North that slavery could not be maintained as Northern soldiers came face to face with the reality of slavery. Emancipation was a tool to inflict economic harm on the South during war, but afterwards it was spread to even the states that remained in the Union.
I don’t know. I think that the south did leave the union for the lack of states rights. But one of those rights happened to be slavery. So yeah. Not the main reason the war started but it was so ingrained into the culture that slavery would never have been given up willingly
So this is a two-month-old post I’m replying to… but hey, it keeps coming up.
The southern states attempted to secede to preserve the institution of slavery. That was the only “right” up for debate. There were four Confederate declarations of independence, and they all make that clear.
The southern states didn’t give a shit about “state’s rights” when the free states objected to Fugitive Slave Acts making their police moonlight as slave hunters.
As an archaeologist, I explain why our profession is needed in the historic period to little kids with “most people [in the historic past] weren’t rich white men or monks…but everyone leaves rubbish”.
I thought there was one where he was executed before he did anything, because a 10 year old boy showed up out of nowhere claiming that the Gerudo diplomat was going to take over the world and sold the 10 year old Hyrule princess on the idea as well. In fact Coelasquid did a comic about that timeline.
Breath of the Wild is decently impossible to fit into the timelines as is, with Downfall being the best fit. As such, I’ve got a mostly-consistent single timeline theory – the one weird part is with Majora’s Mask and the actual timeline weirdness around that, but the rest kinda works well.
I figured Majora’s Mask was a dream Link was having while he was in that 7-year coma–one created by the sages to psychologically prepare him for being an adult. It’s a weird, dreamlike world with familiar faces doing unfamiliar things, he uses a lot of the items you get AS an adult, he has a doppelganger who is an adult trapped in a child’s body, and if you get 100% on the masks his final form is basically Adult Link. And it’s unbearably sad because he’s leaving his childhood behind.
That doesn’t work, though. The backstory for the game is that he is looking for Navi after she wandered off at the end of OoT. The official stance is it’s a parallel universe.
To be fair it’s barely chartreuse. They released a proper classic tunic with the Amiibo and the hat brim is bright yellow; you can really tell what the tunic would look like if they wanted it to be intentional.
Majora’s Mask took place almost directly after the events of Ocarina of Time, and it took place in an alternate dimension. So essentially it can just be written off.
The Hero’s Shade is the Link from OOT, and OOT Link is believed to be Majora’s Mask Link as well. Whether Majora’s Mask really happened or had an impact on any of the timelines is is one question, but the shade outright admits he was a previous hero and that he’s lingering on because so much of what he did was forgotten (timeline shenanigans) and he never got a chance to teach anyone his best fighting moves.
I’m very ignorant of the Zelda-verse so excuse my question, but how does he “win flawlessly” if he’s been killed? Or is it Link who’s won flawlessly?
I keep meaning to either go out and buy all the Zelda games, or just sit down and watch a playthrough of them, but I never have the time and/or money.
three different ending, the Ocarina of time is basically a point in the games where based on how those events played out future games are different.
i think they used this game because it messes with time travel so different timelines after that isn’t that weird.( as a certain doctor would say wibbily wobblly timy liny)
but a common feature of the downfall timeline (the one where link dies) is that the zora become corrupted and enemies in the games.
i believe both Twilight princess and wind waker are timelines where he won flawlessly (the flawless win is when link goes back in time and stops ganon before he can even start)
the timeline i am least familiar with is the one where he beats ganon normally.
I think wind waker may actually be the normal timeline, not the one that split off when Link went back to the past and changed everything.
Supposedly in wind waker, previous OOT Link beat and sealed Ganon, then disappeared because Zelda sent him back in time. So when Ganon busted out again, because Zelda sent him back, there was no Link to stop him that time. So Hyrule had to pull a desperation move and everything flooded.
Could be wrong though, been a few years since I reread Hyrule Historia.
Adult timeline (Wind Waker, Phantom Hourglass, Spirit Tracks)
Child timeline (Majora’s Mask, Twilight Princess, Four Swords Adventures)
Downfall timeline: ALttP, OoS/OoA, Link’s Awakening, ALBW, original Zelda, Zelda II.
Ocarina of Time divides time into two segments; the parts where Link was a child and the parts seven years later. At the end of the game, both segments have their own future. The child timeline is when Link is sent back at the end of the game, and uses his knowledge and the mark of the Triforce of Courage on his hand to thwart Ganon’s plans.
Navi leaves him, and he goes off to find her, which leads to Majora’s Mask.
In the “adult” timeline, because Link was sent back in time, the timeline has no hero left. When Ganon breaks out of the seal, there’s no hero to stop him, and the Gods are forced to flood Hyrule.
A long time later, a new hero is born anyways, but Hyrule is beyond saving, so Link and Zelda set off to found New Hyrule.
The DT is what happens if Link is defeated by Ganondorf at the end of OoT. Think of it like getting a bad ending in a visual novel.
The sages that Link freed manage to trap Ganondorf anyways, but not before he obtains the entire Triforce and becomes Demon King Ganondorf, ruler of the Dark World.
This is the timeline where Ganon keeps returning as a blue pig wizard rather than a man who can transform.
It was before he’d done most of his evil but he had already started doing evil and killing things in his way. The whole reason Link is even talking to Zelda is because Gannondorf cursed and murdered the Deku Tree.
IIRC: Ocarina of time was the FIRST time Hylia, The Hero, and Demise reincarnated. so Demise-as-Ganon didn’t realize that there was a Hero to placate in any way.
That and Demise’s whole curse was that he’d be reborn with them to cause them hardship. By his whole deal, if he’s around then there’s going to be some hero out there he needs to take care of.
I’ve always considered it telling that there were Gerudo at the Yay Ganondorf’s Gone party at the end of Ocarina of Time.
Though to be fair to Coel’s version of G, she has pointed out the possibility that Ganondorf started out as well-intentioned as he says before he was fully taken over by Demise’s curse.
I mean, yeah, if how it went down was Zelda telling her father Ganondorf was evil right in front of him and her dad agreeing, he’d have every right to be pissed, considering he would have almost sworn fealty to a racist prick and his racist daughter. That isn’t what happened, but in the case of the comic, the history of Ganon vs Hyrule is more morally grae. Which is why we like G and he doesn’t come across as hypocrite.
Well, Ganondorf and Twinrova betrayed Nabooru, their third-in-command. The Gerudo also didn’t exactly get to leave the desert even after Ganondorf won.
There’s a brief fic out there where the Evil Plan is subverted by Zelda being sent to live amongst the Gerudo for a month to overcome her dislike for them, and the author’s take on it seems to be that Ganondorf was sliding down a slippery slope; he started out trying to make life better for his people but lost his way when he went mad with power. Seems to fit decently well with the WW-era, calmer, less murderous Ganondorf, who doesn’t even want to kill Link until after the Triforce is nabbed out from under his nose.
Yes, but this is the internet, where strong female characters routinely get redrawn to fit the stereotype of a woman as a sex object.
For example, Legend of Korra has a lot of bad fan art that tones down or gets rid of Korra’s musculature, and gives her bigger breasts, wider hips, a larger butt, and other stereotypically “sexy” features.
It’s not remotely surprising that Coela draws Urbosa like… well… Urbosa, but it can easily be considered refreshing compared to how a lot of the rest of the internet transforms her into just another cookie cutter “sexy” blow up doll in an Urbosa wig and costume.
Exactly. Some people have a very bad imagination when it comes to drawing sexy women. It’s always the same old boring supermodel stereotype.
This is why it’s so nice when artists like Coela give us a nice variation of fanservice. Just take Rock and all his sexy former brothers and sisters in arms as a example.
This is an ingame screenshot of some kind? Because if so… she’s certainly buff, and her nose is on the big side, but from what I can see of the rest of her body shape, she certainly seems to fit most of the “internet sexy woman” stereotype points. Revealing attire, a ‘generous’ chest (though fortunately not to anime standards), slim, and I would be utterly unsurprised at an hourglass waist as well (can’t find a full body photo as of yet, but the indications are there).
I guess I don’t really see what the fuss is about.
The muscles make a big difference. In my personal experience, I’ve heard a lot of people verbally say that women shouldn’t have large muscles. My gym teacher even assured my aerobics class that it “wouldn’t make you look too buff” because there is a general body standard that women shouldn’t look strong, at least in the part of US where I live. Although Urbosa does have general shape of “internet sexy woman,” she has a few important features that deviate from that. A lot of drawings of her slim down her arms, remove her abs, and giver her a small nose and ears. This is aggravating specifically because she is a physically powerful character in game, and the muscles are an important trait that many people remove because they think it looks better. https://goo.gl/images/RWJSbv
Like look at those arms. I don’t want to include any fanart because I don’t want to attack individuals over what is a pretty insignificant issue, but if you just google Urbosa fan art, many of them will include stereotypically slim shoulders and undefined arms. Of course, there also many artists who do it right, too.
Tl:dr Women with big muscles like to see other women with big muscles.
I actually think the pendulum swung too far and that she’s a bit too fearsome looking (Though it’s mostly the goofy face she’s making while yelling at him). Urbosa’s face is much softer then that. She’s big and strong yes, but she’s also curvy and feminine.
I personally love Urbosa for being both. Raging powerfury to enemies and deep compassion for companions. Very mama-bear like, The same kind of subversion to “roid rage stoic is good” that this comic often parodies.
For the rec, love the way you drew her; she does not need to be soft and pretty because she is shouting at a pigheaded ass.
MGDMT’s incarnation of Ganondorf is basically WW’s calm, patient, vaguely regretful version taken a bit further. He still enjoys messing with Link a bit but is mostly just tired of making war on Hyrule and then immediately getting killed by a prophecized destined hero.
Basically, he’s more or less the ideal end version of those who’ve successfully gone through the Commander’s “ease into normal life” program.
Twinrova is a composite of Kotake and Koume, who are each around four centuries old. I’m sure Ganondorf didn’t like his nannies busting out the catsuit either. I shudder to think how he was raised by them… “Ganondorf, eat your vegetables or we bring out the CATSUIT”
How does BotW fit into the increasingly knotted up Zelda timeline anyway? Was Hyrule Castle Town ever actually full of zombies in this timeline, or is this the one where Link and Zelda got Ganon executed while they were kids?
asically? Something REALLY screwy is going on. A going theory is the three timeline collided somehow, as there are two races that shouldn’t be co-existing, and one race that was missing in some games that you’d have expected to see them.
The Gerudo didn’t appear at all in Wind Waker, but their buildings do. the Gerudo Desert is still called the Gerudo Desert. there is a building resembling the Gerudo’s Fortress in roughly the right place. Theories vary between the Gerudo being exterminated, or being thrown to Twilight and becoming the Twili, OR the Gerudo simply cross-bred with Hylians and faded away culturally speaking.
The Rito( birdfolk ) are what happened to the Zora when the world was flooded in the prologue of Wind Waker. they were forced to land as the water could no longer support them. (not sure if it was because they were freshwater, but there was also a mention of the Great Sea not really having any FISH. ) we KNOW this is the case as the Wind Waker era Sage of the Earth was a Rito girl who was acknowledged as the blood descendant of the Flood Era Sage of Earth. The Flooded Era Sage was a Zora who stayed at her temple, praying to the godesses as the rest of Hyrule fled to the mountains that would become Islands.
I don’t think the Gerudo fading away through cross-breeding with Hylians is the case because historically pretty much every Gerudo child has a non-Gerudo parent, yet they all share the same distinctive phenotypes. Gerudo have some serious genetic staying-power.
Someone posited “Gerudo” is a sex-linked variant of Hylians that requires two mutated X chromosomes to present, like Calico cats. Granted, that would mean Ganondorf is sterile, so work that into your fanfics however you need to hahaha.
BotW has references to all games in all timelines. The developers only stated that Breath of the Wild is chronologically the last Zelda game in the Timeline for now, and that a corruption of Hyrule’s history over the years made it impossible to know what references are myths and what references are based on actual history.
This in turn raises questions about whether or not all Zelda games really happened, or if some of them are fairy tales that had such a cultural impact the people named various settlements and landmasses after these fictional worlds.
For example, the Mabe Village Ruins in BOTW are a callback to Mabe Village in Link’s Awakening, which was a fake village on a fake island inside of the imagination of a giant flying whale.
Assuming some of those races left Hyrule (and thus the area that later became the Great Sea) during the calamity, there’s nothing really stopping them from coming back or being found elsewhere later. That said, the WW timeline seems like it’d be the least likely one; there’s no railroads linked to the spirit of the land like in ST, and WW Ganondorf was probably the most mentally stable and rational version ever seen.
Well the boring response is that there’s no unified timeline. Some games are connected, e g OoT and Windwaker or Zelda 1 and Zelda 2, but they’re largely meant to be independent, telling similar stories with the same story elements.
But I know some people really enjoy trying to force timelines together even with the creators saying basically the above explicitly, so I’ll leave you alone now.
Well…. Ganondorf is really more of an avatar of Demise born into a time where Hylians were being dickish. Remember, Link was a Hylian whose parents threw him into a forest that transform people into Skullkids. What? Were there no orphanages?
I swear, if Link didn’t get pushed out from Kokuri Forest when he did, he was going to be like the main character from the movie Elf. Well, he still kind of is, communication skills-wise, but with a SWORD!
Which makes me wonder who Link’s legal guardian is…
Anyways, why didn’t Ganondorf do anything with his new authority over Hyrule? Filling the town with Redead doesn’t seem to be helping him or the Gerudo… Maybe his two nannies spoiled him too much.
for what it’s worth… The Hero of Time’s mother fled to the forest to escape the Hyrulian Civil War and died there, rather than his parents just chucking him into the woods.
Man as a kid that mention of his mom totally made me think link and zelda would be siblings. He had a mom run off, she had no mom at all, she said he was familiar when they met… I was totally surprised when what I assumed was canonical long lost siblingness in this game never got brought up.
I don’t know why him having a mom made me think his family must be a dramatic part of the story.
To be fair, OoT was kinda based on medieval Europe, and it was not uncommon to just dump a baby if you couldn’t take care of it and most of the times that meant killing it. Dumping the bodies, alive or dead, in public parks or latrines was not uncommon. Even if you brought it to a ‘foundling home’, most babies didn’t survive infancy. Same for dropping them of at a monastery, or any other place.
This isn’t just medieval Europe, it happened everywhere for most of history. But this is not the place for a lesson in history or evolutionary psychology. Just look at fairy tales like ‘Hansel and Gretchen’ and ‘Little Thumb’: the extremely poor parents consider sending all of their children off into the woods, possibly so they themselves can survive long enough to give birth when they are more financially stable, instead of dying of hunger this very month together with their current kids.
In other words, Link was actually very lucky.
Cause Ganondorf is a huge dictatorial dick more interested in amassing power than what to do with it? That kinda is the way it usually goes with these kinda characters.
I mean, we know nest to nothing about the king of Hyrule. Maybe when he “united the country” He basically beat the shit out of everyone and forced them to obey. Then, Gannon was pushed to do what he did because his entire people where displaced, and scorned as thieves.
Post-living free labour! Strap trays on their heads or something. Need your grain milled in dry season while the wind’s down? Attach zombies to your quernstone! You’re just not thinking creatively about all the advantages of the, ah, minor zombie apocalypse there…
Reminds me of the end of Shaun of the Dead.
The webcomic Unsounded has those as an important background detail.
Cool! I’ll take a look at that – the social and tactical ramifications of necromancy have always struck me as massively underexplored in most tales.
There is a Japanese novel (with manga and movie adaptions) called “The Empire Of Corpses” that, though it went off the rails a bit at the end, has a really really interesting and extensive take on this played 100% straight. Might be worth a glance. Basically it’s the Victorian age British Empire (alongside other great powers) where Dr Victor Frankenstein was a real person who developed reanimation technology, and the basic knowledge gets out to the general world. Unlike him they can’t fully replicate/replace the “soul” but they can make a limited artificial program/soul for it called Necroware. They then simply use it like any other scientific invention, with corpses raised and programmed (necroware programming and engineering is now a profession) to perform all sorts of basic roles in terms of labor, combat, etc.
The novel itself has plenty of flaws towards how the plot goes down in the end, but even so I haven’t seen anything quite like it. It’s kind of a wild visualization, like a necromantic steam/clockwork version of mass automation.
Are bodies donated?
It’s probably because in most settings the undead basically radiate dark magic/energy/etc so on an industrial scale it’s actually less healthy than using unshielded plutonium for everything.
There’s a reason that necromancers look creepy.
Link might be a dick, but Urbosa has a point.
Maybe the only way to make this work is the way its shown in A Tale of Two Rulers, by Figmentforms. I really like how she treats the Timeline.
Ganondad is indeed great, though I’d also love to see the adventures of GanonMom. That one surprised me.
I literally just came from that comic here.
after yesterday’s update I just want to grab ToTR!Zelda and shake her.
GANON IS FOND OF RINKU! you can just TELL him!
I don’t think that’s a good idea. He is fond of Rinku, yes, but can you imagine the MESS that would arise if he’d learn that she is Link? Not to mention that if his underlings learn they might try to kill her. There is Millennia of Link-centred trauma inside Ganon’s mind. We don’t know what he might do if he learns the truth.
He just needs one huge reminder that in this particular timeline NO ONE wants little Rinku to turn into Link. And that if Ganon can stay a good Ganondad, he would actually be taking steps to ensure that it doesn’t happen. The problem is the conversation would need to take place below about 50 tons of rock so by the time Ganon would have dug himself out he could have calmed down enough to think rationally.
Zombie Apocalypse can be a tourist attraction!
I’m kinda reminded of that episode of B99 where they were voting for the new president of Black&Gay police officer organization and Holt was all “This kid has NO IDEA what we had to go through to get here”.
“Maybe that’s just a matter of opinion”, “History is a matter of speculation”…
Postmodern virus infection, late stages? Godammit, G! Not you! Not you!!
(sobs)
We’ll miss you, man.
Do you know what postmodernism is? It does not look like you do.
A postmodernist lense will give you the idea that nothing is objectively good or bad. When used to view history, most things turn amorally grey and no concrete good or ill can be seen.
That being said, Ganondorf is not going postmodern on his own history, but rather pointing out that history is written by those who win, and that he very much has good reasonings behind his choices. I think Wind Waker’s Ganondorf does this better, but there he was justifying it to Link and not his great-times-infinity granddaughter.
History is NOT written by those who win: Somehow, we all hate the Mongols despite them doing nothing but win; the Athenians lost the Peloponnesian war, but they wrote the history of it; we’ve got a lot of records from Egypt indicating they won a battle and their opponents claiming a victory in the same engagement; the Prussians were far more significant to Waterloo than Wellington; the Lost Cause myth has been incredibly pervasive in the US, despite the Confederate’s loss; the list can go on and on.
The literate write; what we have may or may not be the victors perspective.
History is written by those who win, and then endure. Those that endure, after all, are the true winners of the war, no matter the battles in between.
The Mongols won and won and won but tanked their empire really hard, really fast – in the end, they weren’t the winners. The Athenians lost the Peloponnesian War but later subsumed Sparta as Greece became a thing.
Put another way, victory does not mean success, and what the saying really should be is that history is written by the successful.
..the Confederacy seems a bit of an outlier, though I’d argue that the main thread of the Civil War that’s taught is still that it was fought to free the slaves, immediately painting it into a black and white good guy vs. bad guy scenario, with the Confederacy as the bad guy. Get deeper and it’s more complicated, of course.
And important thing to remember is that while the Union, under Lincoln, fought to simply reunite the Union, the Confederates separated and fought against Northern aggression so as to keep their highly profitable economy from being taken away from them. It was as much a battle of slavery and a battle of state’s rights.
The South wanted to retain the right, as states, to determine big ticket things like slavery, the North largely just wanted to reign in the unruly and petulant children that were throwing a collective tantrum because the North had decided that human lives are a priceless thing and people can not be bought or sold and thusly would destroy the economy of the South in the name of equality.
You’re right that the Civil War is painted in a black and white manner but is in fact a lot more nuanced, but the reason “The South shall rise again” is still a thing is because of a very primal Us vs Them mentality bred among the more fanatical Southern locals. To them the North were the aggressors, and they’re kinda right. To them the war was unjust and wrong, even if their side were fighting for a thing most of them would agree is a terrible thing.
Also, I agree that “History is written by those who endure” is probably a better way of putting what I said previously. In the context of MGDMT and other LoZ(-ish) comics wherein Ganondorf remembers all of his lives Ganondorf is the ultimate history book, able to bring forward information for which the historians of any era he finds himself would kill. In this case, Urbosa being a giant brat about the events of Ocarina of Time, he is the one who endured, but so, too, did Hyrule and Zelda. Hyrule did what it, as the one who seemingly properly endured, would do, and wrote about his atrocities as if he was a monster hellbent on destruction. Meanwhile in Wind Waker we get Ganondorf’s side of the events of OoT, wherein he started off with the best of intentions, helping his people as their king, but things spiraled out of control, forcing him to change with the tides of history into the very beast Hyrule would claim he was the entire time.
The USA are still racist as fuck. I’d say the confederates are enduring still.
underappreciatednecromancer, I’d say DonKalypso has explained the joke better than I could.
To be fair, we never really got to see what life was like for the Gerudo before Ganondorf was around. From what WW tells us, it was kinda terrible, but that account was from Ganondorf himself, so make of it what you will. I personally subscribe to the theory that he was a decent king until he went mad with power.
Incidentally, Urbosa is my favorite of the old Champions.
I’d believe it. WW Ganondorf is really beaten down and mellowed out by the weight of his own failures and doesn’t strike me as really giving a damn about lying to make himself sound better. He doesn’t even intend to kill Link or Tetra until after he goes mad with rage when he loses the Triforce.
History is written by the winners and criticized by the losers.
History is written by the bullshitters, who then claim that they were winners.
I’m stealing that quote.
That’s why we love the Mongols, think that the US Civil War was about anything other than slavery, think France was totally asking for the Franco-Prussian War, think Athens won the Peloponnesian War, have extensive writings from Germanic tribes about Teutoberg…
Oh, wait, wait, wait. That’s not how it happens.
Well actually…
The mongols under Genghis Khan DID bring a lot of good things with them, including but not limited to laws, literature, nationalism(back when that was a good thing), and wealth.
But the other stuff, yeah, more or less.
They also hindered the expansion of Islamist Jihadis. Though not before they conquered half of the Christian world :C
They put the Middle East to the torch after they force converted many of his people, so Khan was genuinely pissed with a reason.
Yeah Mongols were a perfect case study in a lot of good things being done alongside what is to our modern minds a lot of bad stuff, with the mongols you can’t ignore one side of the coin in favor of the other since their both so intertwined. Nor should you justify the horrible things done, BUT that said it’s good to consider all those horrible things in the context of the times they happened in.
The US civli war was about the south wanting to secede and become it’s own country which the north was not cool with. The whole freeing slaves thing was more ir less something the north did just to piss off the south.
Yes, but the South didn’t declare succession until AFTER the Emancipation Proclamation, and the Charters of Succession for almost every confederate state included slavery among the “rights” they wanted to protect from Federalist control.
I don’t disagree that the proximate cause of the Civil War was slavery. Perhaps one could argue that the underlying resentment stemming from loss of regional power (that is, the election of Abraham Lincoln without a single Southern electors’ support) may have been the cause, but it doesn’t really hold water. The Lincoln-Douglas debates from the senate race of 1858 clearly demonstrate this, though they do show the nuance of the pro-slavery argument (which are far more nuanced than many arguments today relating to questions of human dignity for “inconvenient” persons).
However, I’m not finding anything online called “Charters of Succession.” I think you mean “declarations of secession.” The Emancipation Proclamation came after the Union victory at Antietam in September 1862 (after over a year of fighting). It fails the sniff test as an argument, because we know the war has been going on for over a year, and declarations of secession were issued in early 1861 (if you meant “secession,” then you’re just wrong about this), and any laws passed relating to “succession” wouldn’t really be significant, inasmuch as they related to causes, particularly since causes were well-documented in 1861. Could you elaborate on the “charters?”
Yes, secession. Apologies, I am unsure if I simply misspelled that or if it was “corrected” but I did not mean succession. What I mean is, every state that joined the Confederacy had a document outlying their intent to leave the Union and almost every single included their “right” to slavery as a reason. When I say charters, I mean with a lowercase C, because that wasn’t what they were officially called. Regardless, this was all before the war broke out because none of the states attempted to secede AFTER it was over.
I think Confederate officer John S. Mosby said it best. “I’ve never heard of any other cause than slavery.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_S._Mosby
TLDR: the confederates at the time emphasized: “We’re doing this because a black man would be worth about $50,000 in 2018 after adjusting for inflation, so a hundred slaves is $5,000,000 worth of property creating millions of dollars worth of profit every year. And those damned Yankees have the gall to suggest that basic human rights are more important than our continued luxurious lifestyles – especially after we’ve spent so much effort rationalizing and spreading racist beliefs to justify talking about our freedoms while treating other people like cattle. Also, because we have money we’re going to make our poor white neighbors go out and fight on our behalf while we talk about needing to stay at home and prevent slave uprisings, because we haven’t done enough yet to emphasize what hypocrites we are.”
It takes some higher brand of mind-screwing hypocrisy to be a devout Christian while wholeheartedly supporting slavery… Then again that accusation can be aimed at most of the white world at the time…
Slavery in general IS biblical, though. The particular variety of slavery that led to the American Civil War probably wasn’t the sort of slavery they were talking about in the Bible, though. (Not saying slavery is a good thing, but I do think it’s important to remember that historically, it wasn’t considered a truly heinous evil until recently, relatively speaking.)
Biblical… how? That slavery has existed? The behavior of what a Christian should be, if they were a slave? “Love your neighbor as yourself,” “Bear one another’s burdens,” and “Go and make disciples of the nations” doesn’t particularly sounds slavery-approved to me.
Even in the Old Testament when the Hebrews were heading into the Promised Land, God commanded them to slaughter everything and everyone they came across (likely to prevent religious contamination and idol worship. When the Hebrews didn’t… well, there was a LOT of examples of them falling away from the faith.) Back to my point, though, the Hebrew people were never commanded to take or make slaves. Others may have offered to become their servants under false pretenses – which the Hebrews then honored rather than killing them, so that God would not punish them for breaking their oaths (Joshua 9).
Both Old and New Testament have many examples for the lack of “slavery is good” arguments. This didn’t stop people of the Civil War era from trying to use it to justify their own thoughts, however – iirc, they frequently referenced the “curse of Noah” where he proclaimed the offspring of Ham would be the servants of his other children: a curse spoken by a -man- and not by God.
http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/slavery_bible.html has a lot more pointed (and short) refutations than I’ve put here, and https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/article/how-and-why-did-some-christians-defend-slavery/ has more information on the “Biblical arguments” for slavery by whites in the civil war
No; the South seceded to maintain and expand slavery. During the course of the war, it became clear to the North that slavery could not be maintained as Northern soldiers came face to face with the reality of slavery. Emancipation was a tool to inflict economic harm on the South during war, but afterwards it was spread to even the states that remained in the Union.
I don’t know. I think that the south did leave the union for the lack of states rights. But one of those rights happened to be slavery. So yeah. Not the main reason the war started but it was so ingrained into the culture that slavery would never have been given up willingly
So this is a two-month-old post I’m replying to… but hey, it keeps coming up.
The southern states attempted to secede to preserve the institution of slavery. That was the only “right” up for debate. There were four Confederate declarations of independence, and they all make that clear.
The southern states didn’t give a shit about “state’s rights” when the free states objected to Fugitive Slave Acts making their police moonlight as slave hunters.
History is written by the people who write down the history.
As an archaeologist, I explain why our profession is needed in the historic period to little kids with “most people [in the historic past] weren’t rich white men or monks…but everyone leaves rubbish”.
Which is true, but by no means the only reason archaeology is important for the understanding of humanity.
but there are three time lines, the one where he wins, the one where he wins flawlessly, and the one were link dies
I thought there was one where he was executed before he did anything, because a 10 year old boy showed up out of nowhere claiming that the Gerudo diplomat was going to take over the world and sold the 10 year old Hyrule princess on the idea as well. In fact Coelasquid did a comic about that timeline.
That’s the “wins flawlessly” timeline.
Breath of the Wild is decently impossible to fit into the timelines as is, with Downfall being the best fit. As such, I’ve got a mostly-consistent single timeline theory – the one weird part is with Majora’s Mask and the actual timeline weirdness around that, but the rest kinda works well.
I figured Majora’s Mask was a dream Link was having while he was in that 7-year coma–one created by the sages to psychologically prepare him for being an adult. It’s a weird, dreamlike world with familiar faces doing unfamiliar things, he uses a lot of the items you get AS an adult, he has a doppelganger who is an adult trapped in a child’s body, and if you get 100% on the masks his final form is basically Adult Link. And it’s unbearably sad because he’s leaving his childhood behind.
That doesn’t work, though. The backstory for the game is that he is looking for Navi after she wandered off at the end of OoT. The official stance is it’s a parallel universe.
It could still work if the Sages and Navi all knew in advance that she’d have to leave and they were preparing him for that too.
If they could pull that kind of bull they’d have just told him not to touch the sword.
someone had a nice theory about it actually,some mild spoilers ahead
the breath of the wild tunic, the actual green one…has a yellow rimmed hat.
apparently, it’s a feature for the dead link timeline
To be fair it’s barely chartreuse. They released a proper classic tunic with the Amiibo and the hat brim is bright yellow; you can really tell what the tunic would look like if they wanted it to be intentional.
Majora’s Mask took place almost directly after the events of Ocarina of Time, and it took place in an alternate dimension. So essentially it can just be written off.
Yes! Finally I have found someone who agrees that majora’s mask took place in another dimesnion!
It shouldn’t be a matter of “agreeing”, though. That’s the actual explanation Nintendo has given. Repeatedly.
So then, if Majora’s Mask takes place in an alternate dimension, how is the Hero’s Shade the link from Majora’s Mask?
The hero’s shade is the link of the winner’s timeline but not the flawless win. TP follows Ocarina if i remember correctly.
The Hero’s Shade is the Link from OOT, and OOT Link is believed to be Majora’s Mask Link as well. Whether Majora’s Mask really happened or had an impact on any of the timelines is is one question, but the shade outright admits he was a previous hero and that he’s lingering on because so much of what he did was forgotten (timeline shenanigans) and he never got a chance to teach anyone his best fighting moves.
He came back.
Because Link returns to Hyrule at the end of Majora’s Mask.
I’m very ignorant of the Zelda-verse so excuse my question, but how does he “win flawlessly” if he’s been killed? Or is it Link who’s won flawlessly?
I keep meaning to either go out and buy all the Zelda games, or just sit down and watch a playthrough of them, but I never have the time and/or money.
three different ending, the Ocarina of time is basically a point in the games where based on how those events played out future games are different.
i think they used this game because it messes with time travel so different timelines after that isn’t that weird.( as a certain doctor would say wibbily wobblly timy liny)
but a common feature of the downfall timeline (the one where link dies) is that the zora become corrupted and enemies in the games.
i believe both Twilight princess and wind waker are timelines where he won flawlessly (the flawless win is when link goes back in time and stops ganon before he can even start)
the timeline i am least familiar with is the one where he beats ganon normally.
I think wind waker may actually be the normal timeline, not the one that split off when Link went back to the past and changed everything.
Supposedly in wind waker, previous OOT Link beat and sealed Ganon, then disappeared because Zelda sent him back in time. So when Ganon busted out again, because Zelda sent him back, there was no Link to stop him that time. So Hyrule had to pull a desperation move and everything flooded.
Could be wrong though, been a few years since I reread Hyrule Historia.
All the games after OoT:
Adult timeline (Wind Waker, Phantom Hourglass, Spirit Tracks)
Child timeline (Majora’s Mask, Twilight Princess, Four Swords Adventures)
Downfall timeline: ALttP, OoS/OoA, Link’s Awakening, ALBW, original Zelda, Zelda II.
Ocarina of Time divides time into two segments; the parts where Link was a child and the parts seven years later. At the end of the game, both segments have their own future. The child timeline is when Link is sent back at the end of the game, and uses his knowledge and the mark of the Triforce of Courage on his hand to thwart Ganon’s plans.
Navi leaves him, and he goes off to find her, which leads to Majora’s Mask.
In the “adult” timeline, because Link was sent back in time, the timeline has no hero left. When Ganon breaks out of the seal, there’s no hero to stop him, and the Gods are forced to flood Hyrule.
A long time later, a new hero is born anyways, but Hyrule is beyond saving, so Link and Zelda set off to found New Hyrule.
The DT is what happens if Link is defeated by Ganondorf at the end of OoT. Think of it like getting a bad ending in a visual novel.
The sages that Link freed manage to trap Ganondorf anyways, but not before he obtains the entire Triforce and becomes Demon King Ganondorf, ruler of the Dark World.
This is the timeline where Ganon keeps returning as a blue pig wizard rather than a man who can transform.
It was before he’d done most of his evil but he had already started doing evil and killing things in his way. The whole reason Link is even talking to Zelda is because Gannondorf cursed and murdered the Deku Tree.
Should have gone with an apathy/sleep curse instead. Kept the Kokori and Link content in the forest.
IIRC: Ocarina of time was the FIRST time Hylia, The Hero, and Demise reincarnated. so Demise-as-Ganon didn’t realize that there was a Hero to placate in any way.
Nope, Demise’s avatar Vaati had already threatened the Hero and Princess twice.
That and Demise’s whole curse was that he’d be reborn with them to cause them hardship. By his whole deal, if he’s around then there’s going to be some hero out there he needs to take care of.
Zelda II kind of proves that Link would be pissed off enough at a sleep curse to go and kick ass.
Why is that actually relevant?
I think Ganon is one of my fave dudes in this comic
I just want to say that I’ve always loved Coelasquid’s interpretation of Ganondorf.
I just want to say that exact same thing.
Can I get in on saying the same thing as well?
I’ve always considered it telling that there were Gerudo at the Yay Ganondorf’s Gone party at the end of Ocarina of Time.
Though to be fair to Coel’s version of G, she has pointed out the possibility that Ganondorf started out as well-intentioned as he says before he was fully taken over by Demise’s curse.
What is Demise’s curse?
I mean, yeah, if how it went down was Zelda telling her father Ganondorf was evil right in front of him and her dad agreeing, he’d have every right to be pissed, considering he would have almost sworn fealty to a racist prick and his racist daughter. That isn’t what happened, but in the case of the comic, the history of Ganon vs Hyrule is more morally grae. Which is why we like G and he doesn’t come across as hypocrite.
Well, Ganondorf and Twinrova betrayed Nabooru, their third-in-command. The Gerudo also didn’t exactly get to leave the desert even after Ganondorf won.
There’s a brief fic out there where the Evil Plan is subverted by Zelda being sent to live amongst the Gerudo for a month to overcome her dislike for them, and the author’s take on it seems to be that Ganondorf was sliding down a slippery slope; he started out trying to make life better for his people but lost his way when he went mad with power. Seems to fit decently well with the WW-era, calmer, less murderous Ganondorf, who doesn’t even want to kill Link until after the Triforce is nabbed out from under his nose.
#GanonWasRight
Only by fighting against you have things improved Gannon Baby…
Gannonbanned.
I like that you draw Urbosa big, buff and big nosed.
Well she is big, buff and big nosed.
Yes, but this is the internet, where strong female characters routinely get redrawn to fit the stereotype of a woman as a sex object.
For example, Legend of Korra has a lot of bad fan art that tones down or gets rid of Korra’s musculature, and gives her bigger breasts, wider hips, a larger butt, and other stereotypically “sexy” features.
It’s not remotely surprising that Coela draws Urbosa like… well… Urbosa, but it can easily be considered refreshing compared to how a lot of the rest of the internet transforms her into just another cookie cutter “sexy” blow up doll in an Urbosa wig and costume.
Exactly. Some people have a very bad imagination when it comes to drawing sexy women. It’s always the same old boring supermodel stereotype.
This is why it’s so nice when artists like Coela give us a nice variation of fanservice. Just take Rock and all his sexy former brothers and sisters in arms as a example.
This comment chain intrigued me, so I did a bit of digging; to clarify matters, this is the Urbosa you’re talking about, right?
https://dotesports-cdn-prod-tqgiyve.stackpathdns.com/thumbor/wxAjJZTtC05BkAD-wDIg6Pxe9tA=/900×0/filters:no_upscale()/https://dotesports-cdn-prod-tqgiyve.stackpathdns.com/article/9a7ea059-e80b-4f35-9350-a597a6cbe509.png
This is an ingame screenshot of some kind? Because if so… she’s certainly buff, and her nose is on the big side, but from what I can see of the rest of her body shape, she certainly seems to fit most of the “internet sexy woman” stereotype points. Revealing attire, a ‘generous’ chest (though fortunately not to anime standards), slim, and I would be utterly unsurprised at an hourglass waist as well (can’t find a full body photo as of yet, but the indications are there).
I guess I don’t really see what the fuss is about.
The muscles make a big difference. In my personal experience, I’ve heard a lot of people verbally say that women shouldn’t have large muscles. My gym teacher even assured my aerobics class that it “wouldn’t make you look too buff” because there is a general body standard that women shouldn’t look strong, at least in the part of US where I live. Although Urbosa does have general shape of “internet sexy woman,” she has a few important features that deviate from that. A lot of drawings of her slim down her arms, remove her abs, and giver her a small nose and ears. This is aggravating specifically because she is a physically powerful character in game, and the muscles are an important trait that many people remove because they think it looks better.
https://goo.gl/images/RWJSbv
Like look at those arms. I don’t want to include any fanart because I don’t want to attack individuals over what is a pretty insignificant issue, but if you just google Urbosa fan art, many of them will include stereotypically slim shoulders and undefined arms. Of course, there also many artists who do it right, too.
Tl:dr Women with big muscles like to see other women with big muscles.
“Tl:dr Women with big muscles like to see other women with big muscles”
Unfortunately almost nobody else does.
https://i.redd.it/bdp4k76b2kry.gif Quite frankly, Urbosa’s waist is rediciously thin compared to her hips.
I actually think the pendulum swung too far and that she’s a bit too fearsome looking (Though it’s mostly the goofy face she’s making while yelling at him). Urbosa’s face is much softer then that. She’s big and strong yes, but she’s also curvy and feminine.
Go ahead and draw your own Urbosas and make them as soft and pretty as you want.
I personally love Urbosa for being both. Raging powerfury to enemies and deep compassion for companions. Very mama-bear like, The same kind of subversion to “roid rage stoic is good” that this comic often parodies.
For the rec, love the way you drew her; she does not need to be soft and pretty because she is shouting at a pigheaded ass.
Why is Ganon in a suit? I thought he was a giant monster made of Malice.
He usually wears a suit in this comic. Click the Ganondorf tag to see his other appearances.
That’s only the most recent version. He’s had physical form in previous Zelda games.
So is Lex Luther…
It’s a suit made of malice.
in MGDMT, Calamity Ganon is a separate entity that is, at last sighting, rampaging somewhere downtown.
MGDMT’s incarnation of Ganondorf is basically WW’s calm, patient, vaguely regretful version taken a bit further. He still enjoys messing with Link a bit but is mostly just tired of making war on Hyrule and then immediately getting killed by a prophecized destined hero.
Basically, he’s more or less the ideal end version of those who’ve successfully gone through the Commander’s “ease into normal life” program.
“I did good for the Gerudo
CHANGE MY MIND”
Don’t be too hard on him Urbosa, he was in a mood and feeling a bit boarish at the time.
This is perfect.
What, zombies don’t deserve a town? Gotta shove them off into a graveyard to hide from your sight?
#DeadLivesMatter
I think you mean #UndeadLivesMatter
All the ReDead want are hugs…
Yeah, everyone in Zelda are terrible people. Guess that makes it close to GTA but with more magic and less dead hookers.
Well, with more magic anyway.
Two points to remember:
Practically everyone dies between games due to time passing.
Great Fairies.
Sounds like Bender Bending Rodriguez could make a better Hyrule. With blackjack! And hookers!
… I’m all for this idea.
You know what, forget Hyrule!
What do you want from him, he was raised by a titty catsuit cougar grandma.
Twinrova is a composite of Kotake and Koume, who are each around four centuries old. I’m sure Ganondorf didn’t like his nannies busting out the catsuit either. I shudder to think how he was raised by them… “Ganondorf, eat your vegetables or we bring out the CATSUIT”
With all of the evidence surrounding the heightened criminal tendencies of young men raised in fatherless homes…
Technically Ganondorf’s right. Ghe gerudo were doing great. Everyone else, not so much.
It’s only because he’s male that they care so much about his actions. With guys being so rare in their society, I bet you get a lot of attention.
How does BotW fit into the increasingly knotted up Zelda timeline anyway? Was Hyrule Castle Town ever actually full of zombies in this timeline, or is this the one where Link and Zelda got Ganon executed while they were kids?
asically? Something REALLY screwy is going on. A going theory is the three timeline collided somehow, as there are two races that shouldn’t be co-existing, and one race that was missing in some games that you’d have expected to see them.
The Gerudo didn’t appear at all in Wind Waker, but their buildings do. the Gerudo Desert is still called the Gerudo Desert. there is a building resembling the Gerudo’s Fortress in roughly the right place. Theories vary between the Gerudo being exterminated, or being thrown to Twilight and becoming the Twili, OR the Gerudo simply cross-bred with Hylians and faded away culturally speaking.
The Rito( birdfolk ) are what happened to the Zora when the world was flooded in the prologue of Wind Waker. they were forced to land as the water could no longer support them. (not sure if it was because they were freshwater, but there was also a mention of the Great Sea not really having any FISH. ) we KNOW this is the case as the Wind Waker era Sage of the Earth was a Rito girl who was acknowledged as the blood descendant of the Flood Era Sage of Earth. The Flooded Era Sage was a Zora who stayed at her temple, praying to the godesses as the rest of Hyrule fled to the mountains that would become Islands.
I don’t think the Gerudo fading away through cross-breeding with Hylians is the case because historically pretty much every Gerudo child has a non-Gerudo parent, yet they all share the same distinctive phenotypes. Gerudo have some serious genetic staying-power.
Someone posited “Gerudo” is a sex-linked variant of Hylians that requires two mutated X chromosomes to present, like Calico cats. Granted, that would mean Ganondorf is sterile, so work that into your fanfics however you need to hahaha.
BotW has references to all games in all timelines. The developers only stated that Breath of the Wild is chronologically the last Zelda game in the Timeline for now, and that a corruption of Hyrule’s history over the years made it impossible to know what references are myths and what references are based on actual history.
This in turn raises questions about whether or not all Zelda games really happened, or if some of them are fairy tales that had such a cultural impact the people named various settlements and landmasses after these fictional worlds.
For example, the Mabe Village Ruins in BOTW are a callback to Mabe Village in Link’s Awakening, which was a fake village on a fake island inside of the imagination of a giant flying whale.
Assuming some of those races left Hyrule (and thus the area that later became the Great Sea) during the calamity, there’s nothing really stopping them from coming back or being found elsewhere later. That said, the WW timeline seems like it’d be the least likely one; there’s no railroads linked to the spirit of the land like in ST, and WW Ganondorf was probably the most mentally stable and rational version ever seen.
Well the boring response is that there’s no unified timeline. Some games are connected, e g OoT and Windwaker or Zelda 1 and Zelda 2, but they’re largely meant to be independent, telling similar stories with the same story elements.
But I know some people really enjoy trying to force timelines together even with the creators saying basically the above explicitly, so I’ll leave you alone now.
Well…. Ganondorf is really more of an avatar of Demise born into a time where Hylians were being dickish. Remember, Link was a Hylian whose parents threw him into a forest that transform people into Skullkids. What? Were there no orphanages?
I swear, if Link didn’t get pushed out from Kokuri Forest when he did, he was going to be like the main character from the movie Elf. Well, he still kind of is, communication skills-wise, but with a SWORD!
Which makes me wonder who Link’s legal guardian is…
Anyways, why didn’t Ganondorf do anything with his new authority over Hyrule? Filling the town with Redead doesn’t seem to be helping him or the Gerudo… Maybe his two nannies spoiled him too much.
for what it’s worth… The Hero of Time’s mother fled to the forest to escape the Hyrulian Civil War and died there, rather than his parents just chucking him into the woods.
Man as a kid that mention of his mom totally made me think link and zelda would be siblings. He had a mom run off, she had no mom at all, she said he was familiar when they met… I was totally surprised when what I assumed was canonical long lost siblingness in this game never got brought up.
I don’t know why him having a mom made me think his family must be a dramatic part of the story.
To be fair, OoT was kinda based on medieval Europe, and it was not uncommon to just dump a baby if you couldn’t take care of it and most of the times that meant killing it. Dumping the bodies, alive or dead, in public parks or latrines was not uncommon. Even if you brought it to a ‘foundling home’, most babies didn’t survive infancy. Same for dropping them of at a monastery, or any other place.
This isn’t just medieval Europe, it happened everywhere for most of history. But this is not the place for a lesson in history or evolutionary psychology. Just look at fairy tales like ‘Hansel and Gretchen’ and ‘Little Thumb’: the extremely poor parents consider sending all of their children off into the woods, possibly so they themselves can survive long enough to give birth when they are more financially stable, instead of dying of hunger this very month together with their current kids.
In other words, Link was actually very lucky.
Aaargh, forgot to properly close the em tag after ‘all’! Moderator, could you fix it please, if at all possible?
Cause Ganondorf is a huge dictatorial dick more interested in amassing power than what to do with it? That kinda is the way it usually goes with these kinda characters.
I mean, we know nest to nothing about the king of Hyrule. Maybe when he “united the country” He basically beat the shit out of everyone and forced them to obey. Then, Gannon was pushed to do what he did because his entire people where displaced, and scorned as thieves.
Doesn’t matter. His people turned against him in OoT because he turned into a powerhungry madman.
I just binged an entire comic series.